Scott Kurtz may be related to Bill Gates (Rant and pic)

War · Post by **War** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 1:31 pm

Van Douchebag on the 'Spot forums wrote:Forenote: The following opinion and picture are my own and done without solicitation, and may or may not be shared by Tauhid Bondia, Keenspot, and/or Keenspace

As most of you have heard of, Scott Kurtz of Player Versus Player filed legal action against Tauhid Bondia of Spells and Whistles claiming Tauhid's characters Rakne and Milton are a ripoff of his characters Jade and Skull.
A demand made by Kurtz is that Bondia immediately either remove or alter anything containing the two offending characters, as well as remove anything relating to the PVP comic from his site.
Mr.Bondia immediately alterred Rakne's hair and then colored Milton green and gave him pants and a jacket in addition to the muscle shirt he had already been wearing.
I for one find Mr.Kurtz's actions deplorable and without just cause.

Who does Scott Kurtz think he is to bully people around in a manner such as this?
Oh yes, I remember - he thinks he's Scott Kurtz.

Yes, there was a similarity between the Rakne and Jade character, but to accuse poor Tauhid of ripping off Jade is stupid.
What's more, I believe the heart of Mr.Kurtz's action was versus the character Milton, a pudgy, blue, unshaven fairy with an Italian-American accent, and that Mr.Kurtz's beef with the character Rakne is just a vain attempt to find a better foothold for a legal suit.

Unfortunately for Mr.Kurtz there is no such thing as a monopoly on pudgy blue creatures.
With Scott Kurtz's attitude it would not surprise me if he turned face and sued Sesame Street over the character Cookie Monster. With his track record of behavior I believe Mr.Kurtz is self-centered enough to do so.

The fact that Mr.Kurtz frightened Mr.Bondia into complying is despicable.

I mean, did Marvel Comics take Jim Valentino to court over his character Shadowhawk, which is clearly reminiscent of Marvel's Wolverine?
Does DC sue Marvel for every little "coincidence" between ongoing series of the rival publishers?
Hell, has SquareEnix ever sued RPG World?

No, of course not.
Everyone respects everyone else and their work and everyone realizes that this is how free enterprise works.

Imagine a world where everyone behaved as Scott Kurtz. There would never be as much diversity in selection of comics both real and web if established creators made unknown artists walk around on eggshells fearing legal action.

What Scott Kurtz has done to Tauhid Bondia is unfair and injust and I demand an apology from Kurtz to Bondia for the trouble he has caused.

Does anyone have anything to add or say?

Was asked to post this here. I agree with this case. I don't know Tauhid particularly well, but I've been his comic since the start and I never saw any similarity between his characters and anyone else. Anyone got comments?

YarpsDat · Post by **YarpsDat** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 1:51 pm

Well, if I was in such a situation, I'd take my archives down and put up "sorry guys, ScotKurtz [insert e-mail here], (also reachable under [insert phone number], [insert another e-mail]) says I can no longer use my characters because they remind him of his own, have fun"

Of course, I'd need to be awfully popular first.

EDIT. By "such a situation", I meant that if the other guy was a total ass trying to sue me, which may or may not be the case. If the other party was anyone reasonable I'd negotiate something, prefferably not requiring me to do anything.

Oh, and I'd probably consult a lawyer and put archives back up after a week or so.

RPin · Post by **RPin** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 1:54 pm

I'd like to let everyone know that I'm starting a lawsuit against Tom Fischbach of Two Kinds. Both our comics display interespecies relationships, and those are copywritten to me and only me. I shall sue the crap out of Tom, even when our comics are not even remotely related to each other.

Seriously speaking, tho, I feel sorry for Tubesteak. The guy seems to have a foot on copyright lawsuit. First, he was the responsible for the AMD/PA episode, and now this.

I won't deny. His style is highly derivative from others, and the aforementioned characters really do have some resemblance. Still, this is not scope for a lawsuit. It most certainly isn't something to make Kurtz so pissed off. The resemblance was there, but it was subtle enough, and S&W is unique on its own. It's not competing against PVP, it's not threating PVP, it's not taking advantage of PVP's marketing power, and I don't see another reason for why he's doing this other than being himself.

Which explains a lot.

Don't worry, Tauhid. I bet things will get better.

Orion · Post by **Orion** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 1:56 pm

Thats pretty damn sick. I suppose redhead and blue skin are enough to make a court case.

Skylark King · Post by **Skylark King** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 2:08 pm

I'm suing my brother... he doesn't have a webcomic either which is totally rupping off my style. He even has the nerve, THE NERVE, to have the same last name as me. I'm older, I didn't have a webcomic before he didn't have a webcomic.

Think I have a chance?

Orion · Post by **Orion** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 2:14 pm

Its worth a shot.

It occurs to me that it would be somewhat poetic justice if someone used the same crap to sue scott, its not as though the young, rapid gamer-nerd is anything like a new caracter concept. And I can think of at least one blonde, ponytailed person who wears sunglasses who predates Bret.

PDI · Post by **PDI** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 3:04 pm

Oh, for crying out loud.

Look: none of you know the details of the case.

Scott isn't out to make a buck, he's pursuing this on advise of legal council, based on legal precedent and his personal interaction with the artist in question.

It's for legal courts to decide.

I'm a little miffed that people seem so ready to crucify Scott based on a lack of information.

Question: What ACTUALLY is the suit? Do any of you really know, or are you just following the rumor mill?

Skylark King · Post by **Skylark King** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 3:11 pm

rumor mill.. totally...

I'm stil suing my brother for not having a webcomic, the bastard.

Orion · Post by **Orion** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 3:13 pm

A good point. Know anywhere we can find that information?

RPin · Post by **RPin** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 3:17 pm

PDI wrote:Question: What ACTUALLY is the suit? Do any of you really know, or are you just following the rumor mill?

I've been following the discussion on both sites since I first heard about it two weeks ago, and I know Spells and Whistles for enough time to know how the characters looked before Scott put up his demands.

I admit that I may know not much about this case. Maybe if I do, I'll start to think Scott's right. Maybe if I was on his place I'd do the same thing. Who knows? But I'm not taking sides with Scott here for the simple reason that I don't think it's right to threaten someone over a friggin' damn ponytail even if law says you can. We need to be less anal about our copyrights, and only worry about the things that really pose as threats to them.

Toxic · Post by **Toxic** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 3:45 pm

I would like to announce I am suing Boxjam of Boxjam's Doodle for use of the baby blue color I use for Waterguy.

Skylark King · Post by **Skylark King** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 3:51 pm

I'm not sure exactly what the issues are, but here's my thought.

When did PVP stop being fun for Scott?

I know this is a very naive statement, but isn't the whole point of this just to enjoy what you do and share that enjoyment with others? If he's looking to turn a dime there's several better rackets to take up. I don't think Spells and Whistles brings in barrels full of cash because a couple of characters looks inda sorta but not really similar to two of his.

Then again, I am a foolish idiot with no experience in the webcomic world. I know nothing.

Ratbert · Post by **Ratbert** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 4:07 pm

Poor baby...wonder what he'd think of this:

http://newtraditionalists.keenspace.com/d/20021023.html

LAWSUIT ME I DARE YOU

MixedMyth · Post by **MixedMyth** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 4:09 pm

Jeez. I was just reading Spells and Whistles, too.

Now, I do have a thing against people who copy someone's work, alter it slightly, and pass it off as their own. But this is completely unfounded and rediculous. I mean...c'mon.

Joel Fagin · Post by **Joel Fagin** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 4:26 pm

Scott seems to find this place when we're talking about him. Any details Scott?

To me, it sounds amazingly petty and bullying. All I can see is the similarity of appearance but since the two artistic styles are both highly iconic and even somewhat similar, I'm not surprised. Heck, the elf looks like an old character of mine named Lord Vaisya and, for that matter, Jade looks like another character of mine named Ciara. That's the whole point of iconic artwork. The viewer fills in the detail.

I'm really holding down a tirade, here. On the face of it, this looks loathesome.

- Joel Fagin

PDI · Post by **PDI** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 4:29 pm

Unfortunately, I am willing tobet he has been instructed NZOT to talk about it, pending the case.

McDuffies · Post by **McDuffies** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 4:59 pm

Hmmm. Van's comic was, I gotta admitt, utterly lame. That is until I read the rant below, with which I completely agree in every point. Specially the part where he claims such lawsuits drag down the creativity.

Well, if I was in such a situation, I'd take my archives down and put up "sorry guys, ScotKurtz [insert e-mail here], (also reachable under [insert phone number], [insert another e-mail]) says I can no longer use my characters because they remind him of his own, have fun"

Of course, I'd need to be awfully popular first.

If I ever get bullied, I'll ask you for advice.

Oh, for crying out loud.
Look: none of you know the details of the case.
Scott isn't out to make a buck, he's pursuing this on advise of legal council, based on legal precedent and his personal interaction with the artist in question.
It's for legal courts to decide.
I'm a little miffed that people seem so ready to crucify Scott based on a lack of information.
Question: What ACTUALLY is the suit? Do any of you really know, or are you just following the rumor mill?

No, and I can see you don't either. So...

Actually, it's Kurtz's reputation speaking again. Two possibilities arise:
1. Scott is popular so every little comic that wants his piece of pie is picking on him.
2. Scot is uptight overwhelmed by the popularity and thinks he owns the world now.
A little help in deciding: There's a lot of popular comics. How comes it happens only to him and one or two others?
Just a little exercise in logic.

Oh, and another thing: I can't possibly think of reasons for suing other artist, that is if I was popular enough to make it worthwhile. If someone took an image I drew? Maybe, but only after discussion with him. If someone took my script? The same. That's about it. If someone had a similar style, similar characters, etc - no point, that's not where influence ends and steal begin.

You can say that it's up to court to decide that. but it's not as simple. Tauhid would have to hire a lawer, pay him and spend his time and effort suing with Kurtz. Kurtz, on the other hand, seems like he already has a lawer in charge of multipe cases Kurtz started. Kurtz knows that Tauhid will rather change the look of his characters then go to court (after all, no matter how ridiculous it is, it's a certain risk and Tauhid's not likely to take it). So, in other words, Kurtz is bluffing.
You're right. He's not after money. He's after power. He wants to prove to himself and everybody else how big "of a comic writer" he is. Pure demonstration of force.

I don't know about you guys, but if I ever liked PvP, after all the controversy we've seen about it in past years, I'd be sick enough never to look at it.

Joel Fagin · Post by **Joel Fagin** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 5:12 pm

Trouble is, I do like PvP. It's not very good by any standards I generally use but it is a daily laugh, and one of the better ones. It also updates at a time when few other comics update.

Nevertheless... He'd never notice, of course, but I'm thinking of giving it up.

- Joel Fagin

Orion · Post by **Orion** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 5:22 pm

Well, I just did something I should have done when I first started posting here. I went the comics in question and took a look to see if I could find some info from more direct sources. As I said, I should have done this from the beginning and I think you guys probably should too. I wasn't able to find anything on the PVP website, but on spells and whistles there is a few pages on the situation, all very mature in my opinion.

I didn't actually learn anything new, beyond the specific demands Kurtz made. However reading over that did allow me a chance to take a bit of a calmer look at the situation, didn't necessarly change my opinions on the wrongness of Scott's demands, but I no longer feel the urge to send him hate-mail or convince someone to sue PVP, which I suppose is always a good thing. As I said, I think it would do good to read it
http://www.spellsandwhistles.net/index.php

Ratbert · Post by **Ratbert** » Sun Jul 04, 2004 5:24 pm

Ooooh, looking at the keenspot forums uncovered this:

http://www.funnyfarmcomics.com/images/copykurtz.gif

Hahahahahahahah what a prick.
Actually, that there was the funniest PvP strip I ever did see, and he obviously didn't write it. PvP is NEVER funny. Well, maybe once in a while. I read almost six months of the thing and could only pick out a few jokes that I hadn't heard a zillion times before. I can understand Penny Arcade's popularity, and Megatokyo's, but PvP? It's just the same thing other people are doing.