Dunk the RedWolf! (Obligary Furry Admin Criticism thread)

[Mercury Hat]

Could people take the lesbian avatar discussion to another thread? This is NOT the place for it.

My only beef with Striker is that he gets on chat while I'm doing homework so I never get to read what he has to say. Of course, when he does get on, it's usually a technical discussion with Kisai.

Yeah, that's part of my only problem with him. He and Kisai fill up the chat with all sorts of technical stuff and the rest of us are just left to stare at the screen for the next 20 minutes. Take it into PM, would you guys ?

[Soap Soaperson]

See, to annoy people, you don't have to jump on a lesbian avatar bandwagon.

Yeah. Wanna know what the guy in my avatar is about to do with his candy-cane?

[edit] AHHH, SORRY! I saw faub's request after I'd posted.

[Toxic]

Ooh boy, I feel bad for Toxic.

[Collapse]

Anyway, my biggest complaint is that I got sacked for doing things that everyone here does (btw, right now I feel you're borderline flaming me, McD). I might argue a lot, but that's a basic characteristic of me and I do it with everyone, even close friends. It doesn't mean I don't respect you. Everyone argues, everyone criticizes, and I don't think I bumped anything in the OT board. I remember a 900+ post thread, an 1100+ post thread, and a discussion about how much the forums can support.

*sigh*
Ok. I give up. I was tryong to give you a good advice, not to argue with you. Go ahead and keep doing what you were doing before, but then don't ask why everyone hates you.

That's bull. You were trying to win an arguement by default by saying if I responded to you I was being bad.

Edit: Here's another example: viewtopic.php?t=62587&start=80

Van was attacking someone and said "mohterfucking" and he didn't get changed to Dead Humanoid Walking.

And to CJ, when were people telling me to calm down that I didn't?

Look, since you all seem to not like me, I'll just leave. I'm starting to not like some of you just as much.

[IVstudios]

Aww come on don't LEAVE, I mean it didn't sound like anyone was saying they didn't like you, just that they didn't like what you did. I guess I really don't know 'cause I didn't see the thread this all refers to, but it can't have been all that bad. This whole thing sounds like the last time Van Douchebag got banned, and most people still seem to like him. Trust me this is the Internet, people here have very short attention spans. In a month no one will even really remember what happened.

[Nyke]

Aww come on don't LEAVE, I mean it didn't sound like anyone was saying they didn't like you, just that they didn't like what you did. I guess I really don't know 'cause I didn't see the thread this all refers to, but it can't have been all that bad. This whole thing sounds like the last time Van Douchebag got banned, and most people still seem to like him. Trust me this is the Internet, people here have very short attention spans. In a month no one will even really remember what happened.

Yes, and I appreciate the short attention span every day I am here.

[Collapse]

What, you mean when I change subjects in the middle of a sentence?

[IVstudios]

...Who are you?

[Mercury Hat]

Okay, then.

Bye.

[Collapse]

See, I am clearly well loved here.

Well, I've made my complaints, and nobody cares or plans to do anything. So toodles.

[IVstudios]

Well collapse, if you're really going to leave then good luck. I hope you're just leaving the forum and not Keenspace all together though.

[Toxic]

He'll be back. They always come crawling back.

[Rkolter]

I don't know why... but I thought I'd add my own .02.

Collapse, I don't think anything you did was "assholy" enough even combined, to warrant banning.

EXCEPT...

The ressurection of old threads to prove a point. Let me explain.

1) You should not have been so certain it would work. You don't know the system the forums runs on. You don't know for a fact that nothing has changed from standard PHP boards.

2) You aren't in a position of authority where you can risk our foruming pleasure (and Keen's money in the form of technician time) by making this kind of decision. You aren't a keen employee, and your testing your hypothesis on Keen's equipment wasn't authorized.

3) The ends do not justify the means. You can't argue that it did work and Kisai and StrRedWolf agreed it worked after the fact. What you did was wrong. You do not get to reap the benefit of positive results. This is true throughout society - you can't steal bread from a store to feed the hungry, then claim justification because the hungry got fed.

For your risking the forum in this reckless manner, and for this reason alone, I fully support your week-long ban.

So now what?

Congrats, you aren't perfect. You made a mistake. You were punished for that mistake. Whether you think the punishment is right or wrong is utterly irrelevant now. Trying to make your case is only working to your detriment.

Look, let me explain:

1) Saying you're going to leave (as opposed to just plain LEAVING) serves only one purpose - to make an impact on us. The problem is, the impact you're making isn't the one you want.

2) Saying that people generally dislike you here serves only one purpose - to make people argue they don't dislike you. The problem is, the people who don't dislike you don't like being accused. *I* don't dislike you; your statement that you're generally disliked offended me because it sounded like you were talking to me too. I'm positive I'm not the only person on the forum who feels this way.

3) Argueing the point that you shouldn't have been banned is only going to keep your banning in mind. If you want to clear your name, drop the subject and just get back to posting normally. We're human. That which isn't kept in mind quickly falls to the back burner.

Anyhow, my .02 is spent. Do whatever you're going to do. We'll react accordingly.

[IVstudios]

No offence rkolter, but at this point it's been pretty well established that the justification of anyone

[Nyke]

Can we still shake him like a newborn?

[Kisai]

Can we still shake him like a newborn?

Geez people.

I deal with this kind of thing at work. If someone says they want to cancel, fine cancel. Just keep in mind that using it as a bluff is risky and sets the expectation that you will really cancel. If you say it only to try and get some benefit from it, then you can't use it a second time.

Remember what happened to the boy who cried wolf? (oh bad pun)

So once again, if you threaten anything, either follow through, or concede defeat.

I did not authorize anyone ressurrecting any threads, but at the same time I didn't authorize banning anyone. Myself and StrRedWolf are not each others subordinates, and thus just because one of wants to do something, or does something, doesn't necessairly mean that we both agreed on it.

I prefer the democratic process and will give a window of opportunity for feedback before doing something that will have an impact. Like right now with the "deactivate all aol.com email users?"

StrRedWolf on the other hand will usually act without waiting for feedback, and usually gets the feedback in the form of criticism for being trigger happy.

Neither of us agree on which communication channels are necessary, where I will usually just go ahead and do something if I think it will have minimum impact, but StrRedWolf insists on letting everyone know, where I have pointed out by the time I update all the communication channels we have, I could have already done what I intended. Beauracracy at work.

If I'm on IRC, I will usually say when I'm going to do something.
If I'm working on the forums, I will attempt to update the news post on http://www.keenspace.com
If I'm working on keenspace.com, I'll post something in the forums.

IRC/forums are my preferred form of communication . I haven't loaded yahoo or icq up in months.

I have a "real job" other than keenspace.com, and StrRedWolf has different hours of availability so neither of us are at the computer 24/7, as much as I'd prefer to work on keenspace.com

Kisai's current wage is 14$/hour Canadian... Keenspace.com does not pay me. My real job does.

So if StrRedWolf is justified in doing something, I don't stop him, but I'd like to know about it in case people start complaining to me. I'm sure the opposite is true as well.

[Collapse]

Okay, now I've another complaint. It's not about Wolf specifically, but I'll stick it here.

Faub said something in one of the threads that I interpreted as a broad attack on all religions that believe in a God and Hell. First, keep in mind that's the vast majority of the world's relgious population.

I was pissed off, so my response was that it was a fucked up, close-minded, prejudicial (etc etc) thing to say. I also complained to McDuffies and Kisai. At first nobody said anything, and then WP threw in his opinion that all religious people are narrow-minded. McD locked the thread when he saw it, and said he didn't know what had gotten into faub or something to that effect.

Kisai responded, not sounding particularly interested, and then Wolf added a post to the locked thread saying he'd gotten another complaint about me.

Seriously people, I don't get this. I get banned for what are basically trivial things, and then other people can come and do things like making (what appears to be) a broad attack on religion without even being warned.

Faub told me he was trying to counter someone else's point by being cynical. He didn't put anything in the post to make it apparent that he wasn't serious or that he was trying to provide a counter-viewpoint. I think he should have made it obvious that he wasn't serious with small text like EVERYONE ELSE always does, but his post is a little more understandable if it was to make a point.

However, neither Kisai nor Wolf mentioned anything about whether Faub was serious. Kisai said she only would have cared if he had locked a thread about religion (?), and Wolf blamed me and also seemed to condone attacking religion.

Is that how things are done around here? You can't say "the themes suck" without getting a warning, or bump three threads without being banned, but you can make an attack on religious groups with no consequences?

Once again, I'm seeing horribly unfair and inconsistent moderation.

[Christwriter]

Dude, the only problem I have with you is that you're WAY too reactionary.

People have a right to say whatever they feel like saying. Yes. This is true. I am very happy the constitution says we have that right.

Now be so kind as to point out the place where it says "You have the right not to be offended".

What? Not there? Then maybe that means that you DON'T have the right to wander through life unoffended.

People bashing my religion offends me. It's like watching somebody beat up your lover to me, which OBVIOUSLY is something personal and something that makes me VERY ANGRY. So what do I do? Stay the heck away from conversations about it because I will either break down into tears or start cutting people's heads off, and I don't want to do either.

The only places I feel free to have a no-holds-barred "attack" on somebody's statements is in either TTT when they ask for a critique, and Comic Pitching when they do the same. And even there, I attempt to keep at least SOME veneer of civility around (sometimes I fail) because I don't want to hurt anybody's feelings. In other places I give my opinions where approprete, respect other people's opinions, and get as far away from the ones that make me angry as I can, because I don't come here to get angry.

The key difference between you and everybody else is that you do it ALL THE TIME. Something offends you WHAM, you hit it, without thinking about what the other people in the forum will think or feel. In my mind, that is inapprorpete behavior. I mean, the thing with the contest seemed to me to be you saying "the catagories suck" and only doing what you SHOULD have done in the first place, which was give reasons why you didn't like the catagories and explain that you would not be participating, after people started defending the contest. And then defending your mistake about as violently as a mother defending her prodgeny, which was also a mistake.

It's not the things you do to me, but the AMOUNT of things you do. Save it for a fight worth both your time and getting banned. You'll get a better rep and you'll have less to complain about. Pick your fights, dude. This one might be worth it, but I don't think the others really were.

CW

[Mercury Hat]

Oh for the love of Christ. It's been said before, it'll be said again: It's not your actions so much as it's your attitude. Attitude, not actions.

You interpreted faub's post incorrectly, you were corrected in the form of a thread lock before things got too ugly. Let it go. You are given so many opportunities to just walk away, but instead you sink your teeth into something and you don't let it go. You are like a stupid pitbull.

Here is free advice for you: If you ever feel like getting in an argument with someone over something stop. Make sure you are reading things correctly but keep your cursor away from the quote/post reply buttons. Once you're sure that you've read things correctly and are ready to post stop. Go make yourself a sandwich and close the browser window because you are not good at debating.

I can also tell you right now you are doing nothing more than painting a large bull's eye on your forehead.

[Wp]

Oh for goodness' sakes, I was hoping no one would reply. To tell the truth, I posted that line to see how thick of a skin you had, but apparently it's not too thick. I have plenty of good religious friends that are open-minded. You need to chill out.