FCBD 2008

For discussions, announcements, non-technical questions and anything else comics-related or otherwise that doesn't fit in any of the other categories.
User avatar
Rickford
Irreverent
Posts: 1065
Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2006 8:52 am
Location: London
Contact:

Post by Rickford »

Kisai wrote:Write one master story, when we figure out our page limit, we divide up the pages. Half tell one perspective of the story(one or two characters,) the other half the tell the other perspective. To make things interesting, let's put 'side A' with one cover that is read forwards, and 'side B' that reads forward, with the final two pages a two-page spread. This gives the option of giving each artist a scenario like this:
"character A has to accomplish this, this and this, and your part ends with this action" "Character B will accompish this and this, and will end with this action"
No. That's an awful idea. No 'one master story'. People write their own material, or it's just illustrating someone else's work.

Everyone else has agreed with going by a theme, so that's pretty much been decided.

User avatar
KWill
Cartoon Hero
Posts: 2421
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 9:37 am
Location: Disappointed
Contact:

Post by KWill »

The Neko wrote:"Flight", etc. is vague, but it allows for more freedom. That way you have different kinds of stories, but at the same time you get some kind of theme throughout them. The more specific, the more restrictive the format becomes.
I see. That makes sense.

Perk_daddy
Regular Poster
Posts: 321
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2006 5:58 pm
Location: Utah
Contact:

Post by Perk_daddy »

War wrote:
perk_daddy wrote:The FCBD book should be an accurate representation of what people should find at CG.
Like I said, put all the WOMB comics in a sampler. Bam, you're done.
How 'bout "should be an accurate representation of some of the kernels of wheat amongst the vast fields of chaff" then?
KWill wrote:I'd suggest "This is the worst day ever" as a unifying theme. It's something that could easily be split into seperate stories and lends itself well to both comical and more serious plots.
That's not bad. Something that could apply to any comic, but isn't at all vague...
ImageImage

User avatar
War
Grr
Posts: 3018
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2003 2:26 pm
Contact:

Post by War »

perk_daddy wrote:
War wrote:
perk_daddy wrote:The FCBD book should be an accurate representation of what people should find at CG.
Like I said, put all the WOMB comics in a sampler. Bam, you're done.
How 'bout "should be an accurate representation of some of the kernels of wheat amongst the vast fields of chaff" then?
So cut out the crap comics?

That's what we've been saying all along.

Perk_daddy
Regular Poster
Posts: 321
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2006 5:58 pm
Location: Utah
Contact:

Post by Perk_daddy »

Yes, but it can be done by either 1) the people in charge just picking people they know, or 2) letting everyone submit their own entry and letting the quality stuff be voted on for the book.

Maybe, getting volunteers to be judges. Each judge is given ten or twenty random submissions, and they pick the one or two they like best. Then final decision is made by the ones in charge, from the ones that make the first cut. Seems the fairest way to go to me, and as many people as want to at least get a shot at making it in.
ImageImage

User avatar
ShineDog
Regular Poster
Posts: 974
Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2004 12:56 am
Location: Ayrshire, Scotland
Contact:

Post by ShineDog »

You guys have already shown you arent capable of voting for quality. Favouritism gets in the way.

FAVOURITE ARTIST THREAD GOD.
Jaw droppingly large strawberry desserts.

User avatar
Prettysenshi
Bork Bork Bork
Posts: 2269
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2004 8:23 am
Location: Anywhere else but here....
Contact:

Post by Prettysenshi »

ShineDog wrote:You guys have already shown you arent capable of voting for quality. Favouritism gets in the way.

FAVOURITE ARTIST THREAD GOD.
That thread had potential too. Oh well.

I really think the theme idea with short stories is the best idea. Also, just throwing this out there. I really think this year's FBCD book should be in color. I know it's more expensive, but it'll look so much better, a lot of people like color to black and white anyway. I think it would be worth the investment.

User avatar
CJBurgandy
Eat at Crazy CJs! Home of the mad burger
Posts: 6538
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 1999 4:00 pm
Location: Too Old for this Shit
Contact:

Post by CJBurgandy »

if stores are complaining that our books cost too much to give away for free, than no, color isn't worth the investment
CLICK HERE FOR HOT SEXY NUDES

"When Papa Smurf drank here, he was standoffish, Turk said. He favored vodka and didn't share his liquor." ~ Anchorage Daily News

User avatar
Prettysenshi
Bork Bork Bork
Posts: 2269
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2004 8:23 am
Location: Anywhere else but here....
Contact:

Post by Prettysenshi »

cjburgandy wrote:if stores are complaining that our books cost too much to give away for free, than no, color isn't worth the investment
I forgot about that. Dang. Well, I thought color pages would be more attractive to the eye.

User avatar
The Neko
A Blithe ray of Schadenfreude
Posts: 3878
Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2003 6:16 pm
Location: New York City

Post by The Neko »

prettysenshi wrote:
cjburgandy wrote:if stores are complaining that our books cost too much to give away for free, than no, color isn't worth the investment
I forgot about that. Dang. Well, I thought color pages would be more attractive to the eye.
Only if the people know how to colour. If they don't, then it looks like ass.
prettysenshi wrote:
ShineDog wrote:You guys have already shown you arent capable of voting for quality. Favouritism gets in the way.

FAVOURITE ARTIST THREAD GOD.
That thread had potential too. Oh well.
Also, no. It didn't. It started off praising DATACHASERS. I mean, WTF kind of precedent is that? It was started off as a circle-jerk and just continued that way.

User avatar
The Neko
A Blithe ray of Schadenfreude
Posts: 3878
Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2003 6:16 pm
Location: New York City

Post by The Neko »

perk_daddy wrote:Yes, but it can be done by either 1) the people in charge just picking people they know, or 2) letting everyone submit their own entry and letting the quality stuff be voted on for the book.

Maybe, getting volunteers to be judges. Each judge is given ten or twenty random submissions, and they pick the one or two they like best. Then final decision is made by the ones in charge, from the ones that make the first cut. Seems the fairest way to go to me, and as many people as want to at least get a shot at making it in.
They all have a chance. You can submit. But if you suck, then it doesn't go in. Jeez. How complicated is it? IT'S CALLED A MERITOCRACY.
Last edited by The Neko on Sun Oct 07, 2007 5:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Prettysenshi
Bork Bork Bork
Posts: 2269
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2004 8:23 am
Location: Anywhere else but here....
Contact:

Post by Prettysenshi »

The Neko wrote:Also, no. It didn't. It started off praising DATACHASERS. I mean, WTF kind of precedent is that? It was started off as a circle-jerk and just continued that way.
I mean potential in the sense that you could say which artists were your favs and why, ya know? Then you can look to positive influences to shape your work. Lots of artists do that. And I know for certain I didn't circle jerk.
Hmm...everyone in the Flight Anthology, especially my girl, Jen Wang.

SpaceCoyote....

Humbug....

Basically, I think all the best artists in the scene are those that studied art for real, like not one class or whatever. I mean, yes Jen Wang is the exception because she's a sociology major, but I mean those who extensively study art or animation are obviously the best, IMO.
I wish people didn't circle jerk as much. If they didn't, this thread would be much much shorter.

User avatar
Kisai
Goddess of Light
Goddess of Light
Posts: 3276
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 1999 4:00 pm
Location: The Past, the Present, The future
Contact:

Post by Kisai »

Rickford wrote:
Kisai wrote:Write one master story, when we figure out our page limit, we divide up the pages. Half tell one perspective of the story(one or two characters,) the other half the tell the other perspective. To make things interesting, let's put 'side A' with one cover that is read forwards, and 'side B' that reads forward, with the final two pages a two-page spread. This gives the option of giving each artist a scenario like this:
"character A has to accomplish this, this and this, and your part ends with this action" "Character B will accompish this and this, and will end with this action"
No. That's an awful idea. No 'one master story'. People write their own material, or it's just illustrating someone else's work.

Everyone else has agreed with going by a theme, so that's pretty much been decided.

And obviously nobody actually read my post in it's entirety. I made a suggestion, not an order. I recommended people, not gave them roles, but seriously, if we can not come to grips with what we want in the FCBD, I will take on the role of the elementary school teacher and assign roles, wether people want them or not. If you recall how teachers assign roles in projects, they always pick their best students first, and assign stuff that couldnt possibly be screwed up to the slow kids, and omit their stuff because they never complete it.

Seriously If we aren't drawing by the end of October, I may as well assign roles. This is how projects work, the people most interested in it, get in.

I recommended rkolter for fundraising because he's done the fundraising bit several times for CG related things and hasn't run off with the money once.

Robin has leadership qualities, but I don't want to see her get burned out over this, the_neko is an honest critic, but anyone we pick for judging has to put their bias aside. If we want to use a group of judges, we could use a voting mechanism that only let's each user cast 5 votes, and only lets each submission receive 5 votes, therefor people save their votes to either vote up the ones they like or vote down the ones they hate, the problem is this again runs into the 'well too many crap comics will just vote each other up'

And yes I'm full of good ideas and bad ideas, just because I suggest it, does not mean it's now written in stone and everyone is going to follow it.

Unless someone else has project leadership experience and really feels they should be running the show here, speak up. If Robin doesn't want such a project, speak up.

End of the month, there better be drawings going on.

Also:
As it stands, the Comic Genesis sampler was a very poor package, from its amateur content to its shameless solicitation for more.
If this is the kind of review we get, I doubt stores will continue to carry the CG FCBD. As it is, I've never seen the CG FCBD in a store, ever.

User avatar
Rkolter
Destroyer of Words (Moderator)
Destroyer of Words (Moderator)
Posts: 16399
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2003 4:34 am
Location: It's equally probable that I'm everywhere.
Contact:

Post by Rkolter »

Kisai wrote:I recommended rkolter for fundraising because he's done the fundraising bit several times for CG related things and hasn't run off with the money once.
If by fundraising you mean, trying to find advertisers, I really haven't done that - cortland found most of our advertisers. But I did act as the treasurer, managing the paypal account and bank account and giving Keenspot the info they needed for taxes (and the cash) at the end of it. I'd be up for doing that again.
Image Image ImageImage
Crossfire: "Thank you! That explains it very nicely, and in a language that someone other than a physicist can understand..."

Denial is not falsification. You can't avoid a fact just because you don't like it.
"Data" is not the plural of "anecdote"

User avatar
Hogan
Regular Poster
Posts: 438
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2006 6:11 am
Location: Where the worlds cross over
Contact:

Post by Hogan »

If there's anything I can do to help this along, save drawing anything, let me know...
When webcomics clash: The Webcomic Crossover & Cameo Archive!
Here it comes... the CameoComic

User avatar
Dotty
Cartoon Hero
Posts: 2434
Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2003 8:29 pm
Location: Drunk!
Contact:

Post by Dotty »

It was mentioned somewhere earlier in this quagmire regarding hits and that FCBD; mine went up a bit. They levelled off and dropped, but thats cause I didn't update for a while. :D

I like the story idea. The judge idea...just pick them good, otherwise you're gonna get the FAVORITISM complaints again. We have a lot of good artists, and I thought last years sampler had a lot of good artists in it too. The problem with last years sampler (and therefore I guess every sampler prior) was that it was a bunch of ads. Mind, thats essentially what I was told it was for, and to put in it, but yes. Ads. With a cover on it where the "best" in the book were put on the cover.

Keep Eric Burns the hell away from the sampler, for the love of god.

The story theme should be interesting. Water has a LOT to work with, but also requires a great deal of technical skill to convey properly. If we're to do this, we can't "over-perfect" ourselves or the book will never get done.

We definitely can't be choosing who goes in the book though, previous attempts and threads have proven we're incapable of choosing the best over our friends. T_T
Caught in the headlamp glare of your own blinding vanity/Mesmerised by the stare of your shallow personality
Gorging the junk food of flattery you drag your fat ego around/Everyone floored by the battering you give to whoever's around
Oh Narcissus you petulant child admiring yourself in the curve of my eyes/Oh Narcissus you angel beguiled unsated by self you do nothing but die

User avatar
Keffria
The Wimpy Teaching Assistant (Mod)
The Wimpy Teaching Assistant (Mod)
Posts: 3748
Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2003 12:07 pm
Location: not-France

Post by Keffria »

We don't need an overcomplicated judging system. So Robin's in charge? Have her pick a bunch of people to act as judges; I have faith in her abilty to choose people who will try to overcome their urge to pick their bestest buddies' comics. So, people submit things, their entries are judged, and anyone who's concerned about the final cut can feel free to send angry PMs to the people involved.

On the theme: even if we do go with something that's hard to convey (water?), it's not as if you have to hit the reader in the face with the subject in every panel by setting it on an ocean, having characters constantly making reference to the water, and devoting entire panels to watery landscapes. It's a theme.

User avatar
Rkolter
Destroyer of Words (Moderator)
Destroyer of Words (Moderator)
Posts: 16399
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2003 4:34 am
Location: It's equally probable that I'm everywhere.
Contact:

Post by Rkolter »

We still need to know how this will be funded. It's not shameful to brooch the topic, and because it's a lot of money, it needs to be dealt with now and not pushed off until later. We needed $2000 last year, we came close, and Keenspot Entertainment funded us the difference AND paid $2000 of their own.

Are people whose submissions are approved going to pay for the pages they use?

Will we have advertisers? How much will we charge for advertising? (I am assuming that advertisements will be vetted by the same people who are vetting the submissions).

Is Keenspot willing to offer us the same deal of paying half? This one I can at least email somebody about *writes note to self*.
Image Image ImageImage
Crossfire: "Thank you! That explains it very nicely, and in a language that someone other than a physicist can understand..."

Denial is not falsification. You can't avoid a fact just because you don't like it.
"Data" is not the plural of "anecdote"

User avatar
Robin Pierce
The Establishment (Moderator)
The Establishment (Moderator)
Posts: 1610
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2005 11:48 am
Location: Should we check the internet? :S
Contact:

Post by Robin Pierce »

See that'd be the stuff I'd ask Cortland to handle because he did a good job of it last year and knows the ropes.

i'll organize the people end of it. I'm a constant presence on the forums and in the chat and any of that can go through me with no problems. But I made clear from the beginning to kees that I wouldn't want to take care of the finance related part - I get enough of that with my every day work, and I don't see the point in my learning a new thing on that when cort already knows how to do it.

So basically - ask cort. I'll send him an email tonight and see where he stands on all this.

But - as it stands:

I'll organize the people aspect of this and the entry dates and roles, as well as putting the final pdf together.
Cort organizes the advertising and where the finances are coming from.
Kolter if you could organize the bank etc as you did last year - I'm not sure what the split of responsibilities between you and cort was.

I agree with Kisai, War and Neko being judges, though I'd shove Keffria in there as well, and a fifth - to be suggested (I'd suggest merc, if she wants it), ONLY as a tie breaker. The four people mentioned all have different skills and opinions that they'd bring to the table, and I would trust any of them to be as unbiased as possible. If this isn't too highly objected to, I will be approaching these people on an individual basis to see if they're okay with these roles.

Next:

How to enter: ANYONE can enter a short story (page count to be decided - reliant on book format)) on a theme (to be decided). These will be voted on and veto'd by the above panel until the best however many remain.

This will all be posted in a formal entrance thread so that it can be seperated from all this discussion.

Now then: Are there any objections.
Image Image Image
Commissions currently at Sale Prices, for details click third link

User avatar
Mercury Hat
Iron Lady (ForumAdmin)
Iron Lady (ForumAdmin)
Posts: 5608
Joined: Sat Jan 24, 2004 1:57 pm
Location: Hello city.
Contact:

Post by Mercury Hat »

I wouldn't mind being a tie-breaker. That's all I do with the Genchans these days and it works out pretty well.

You'll need to figure out a deadline for submissions though.
ImageImage
<Legostar> merc is all knowing, all seeing, and not caring

Locked