OMG HE'S A MUSLIM

Black Sparrow · Post by **Black Sparrow** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 2:31 pm

*WARNING: RANT AHEAD*

Now, i'm usually a pretty easy-going gal. I try to take life with a grain of salt.

This, however, PISSES me off.

This last November, my state elected the first Muslim official to the United States Congress, and, as a Muslim, he wanted to swear on the Quran, rather than the Bible. (If you really want to know what's getting to me, try clicking the "Talk About It" links.)

My take on this? Just let the man swear on his holy book. It doesn't mean a THING to him to swear on the Bible. By letting him use the Quran instead, he'll be more likely to take his oath seriously, and uphold it. It's not the book that's important: it's what the book symbolizes. You want him to swear on something he won't want to betray. Making him swear on the Bible when it's just another book to him invalidates the oath and makes it useless.

Yeah, okay, this nation was founded on Christian principles, I get it. We have a backbone in Christian idealogy, fine. But how does laying your hand on a book undermine our culture? He's not threatening to eat our babies, rape our women, and destroy everything we hold sacred. HE'S AN AMERICAN TOO.

He's a Muslim, not some cracked up backwards extremist, and people are blowing this way out of proportion. I know this is a tired metaphor... but it's like comparing a normal Christian to the KKK. Getting on his back for wanting to uphold his personal idealogy in the name of patriotism is so... hypocritical.

Welcome to America, Land of the Free as Long as You Follow the Status Quo.

Thievery · Post by **Thievery** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 2:42 pm

I agree, why should it matter? Unless I'm severely mistaken, the Koran, Torah, and the Bible are all bibles, right? As in a book of holy scripture. So, aren't they all equal? The congressman is swearing on the bible, just HIS bible.

Nanda · Post by **Nanda** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 2:51 pm

*sigh* This sort of thing makes my head hurt...

TRI · Post by **TRI** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 3:38 pm

Ugh. Mine too....

Although it does make me wonder what would happen if I was elected to congress: I'm not religious so I'd have to bring something else entirely.
Personally I'd bring a copy of the constitution and just watch anyone try to say I was "not willing to use the book our country was founded on"

MixedMyth · Post by **MixedMyth** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 3:49 pm

Crimeny.

I can't believe people still get bent out of shape by someone wanting to swear on another holy book. I mean, there HAVE been elected officials of faiths other than Christianity before. What did they do? Lieberman, for example...did they let him swear on the Torah?

Of course, I want to see someone swear on a puppy. That would be awesome right up to the point when it widdled on someone's shoe. Then it would be even more awesome.

McDuffies · Post by **McDuffies** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 4:23 pm

USA grows less and less of a free country every day. Soon, you folks are gonna start immigrating over here.
When you do, come to visit me

CaptainClaude · Post by **CaptainClaude** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 4:29 pm

dont immigrate here. We're full.

I wonder if they'd let you swear on a bible in a muslim country. hmm.

TheSuburbanLetdown · Post by **TheSuburbanLetdown** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 4:43 pm

Of course they wouldn't but that's not the point.

Let him swear on the Quran. Like already mentioned, swearing on a book you don't beleive in means nothing.

CaptainClaude · Post by **CaptainClaude** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 4:51 pm

the other thing that comes to mind is that hooha some years back when the geeks tried to get Jedi recognised as a bonafide religion. now if that had got in, would they have sworn on the DVDs, the Novelisation of star wars? To this question I must learn the answer

PeppermintAfterlife wrote:Let him swear on the Quran. Like already mentioned, swearing on a book you don't beleive in means nothing.

Aetheists have had to do it in the past. and often it seems swearing on a book you do believe in doesnt make a whole lot of difference.

Czar · Post by **Czar** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 4:54 pm

Sweden has plenty of room, but a large part of the emigrations during the nineteenth century were for reasons of religious persecutions... What with various people refusing to conform to the pure, Swedish Lutheran church. You sure you wanna come back here?

Joking aside, I'm quite sure that we've widened the separation of church and state since the nineteenth century and have no intention of closing that gap in the foreseeable future, not to mention all this talk about peace and unity and a ecumenical unity not only amongst the various christian sects but also between religions.

Ian Moulding · Post by **Ian Moulding** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 4:55 pm

ryclaude wrote:the other thing that comes to mind is that hooha some years back when the geeks tried to get Jedi recognised as a bonafide religion. now if that had got in, would they have sworn on the DVDs, the Novelisation of star wars? To this question I must learn the answer

PeppermintAfterlife wrote:Let him swear on the Quran. Like already mentioned, swearing on a book you don't beleive in means nothing.
Aetheists have had to do it in the past. and often it seems swearing on a book you do believe in doesnt make a whole lot of difference.

He'd have to swear on the pre-CGI original movies, the three preludes, plus a stack of post-CGI originals. That would cover the full range of Star Wars canon. Everything else is just fiction.

TheSuburbanLetdown · Post by **TheSuburbanLetdown** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 4:55 pm

ryclaude wrote:the other thing that comes to mind is that hooha some years back when the geeks tried to get Jedi recognised as a bonafide religion. now if that had got in, would they have sworn on the DVDs, the Novelisation of star wars? To this question I must learn the answer

Heh heh, oh my. You'd be hard-pressed to find anyone that actually have midichlorians in their blood.

ryclaude wrote:
PeppermintAfterlife wrote:Let him swear on the Quran. Like already mentioned, swearing on a book you don't beleive in means nothing.
Aetheists have had to do it in the past. and often it seems swearing on a book you do believe in doesnt make a whole lot of difference.

True. We should just make people swear to do their job to the fullest of their abilities or they'll be exiled to the moon.

CaptainClaude · Post by **CaptainClaude** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 4:57 pm

Ian Moulding wrote:
ryclaude wrote:the other thing that comes to mind is that hooha some years back when the geeks tried to get Jedi recognised as a bonafide religion. now if that had got in, would they have sworn on the DVDs, the Novelisation of star wars? To this question I must learn the answer
He'd have to swear on the pre-CGI original movies, the three preludes, plus a stack of post-CGI originals. That would cover the full range of Star Wars canon. Everything else is just fiction.

This is where different factions come up.
Some believe in luke. some dont. some do believe in him just that he was not our saviour.

PeppermintAfterlife wrote:Heh heh, oh my. You'd be hard-pressed to find anyone that actually have midichlorians in their blood.

That's Book of revelations bullshit, lots of crazy crap in there.

PeppermintAfterlife wrote:
ryclaude wrote:
PeppermintAfterlife wrote:Let him swear on the Quran. Like already mentioned, swearing on a book you don't beleive in means nothing.
Aetheists have had to do it in the past. and often it seems swearing on a book you do believe in doesnt make a whole lot of difference.
True. We should just make people swear to do their job to the fullest of their abilities or they'll be exiled to the moon.

Screw that, exile them to the moon now and save time and effort.

Nanda · Post by **Nanda** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 5:29 pm

TRI wrote:Ugh. Mine too....

Although it does make me wonder what would happen if I was elected to congress: I'm not religious so I'd have to bring something else entirely.
Personally I'd bring a copy of the constitution and just watch anyone try to say I was "not willing to use the book our country was founded on"

Atheists can’t hold public office in four states. And President Bush openly said in his campaign that atheists can’t be patriots and shouldn’t be citizens. So the chances of you being elected to public office are pretty slim anyway.

TRI · Post by **TRI** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 5:29 pm

Orthodox Jedis swear on the original moves, Reformations swear on the Special Edition re-release.

Only Gnostic Jedis and members of the Jacen Solo Church of Latter Day Jedis swear on the novels.

Joel Fagin · Post by **Joel Fagin** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 5:46 pm

Why does the one country that has separation of church and state enshrined in one of it's official, defining documents have trouble with this sort of thing when countries like England who have a monarch appointed by the Christian God simply don't have it as an issue?

- Joel Fagin

Ahaugen · Post by **Ahaugen** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 5:49 pm

Joel Fagin wrote:Why does the one country that has separation of church and state enshrined in one of it's official, defining documents have trouble with this sort of thing when countries like England who have a monarch appointed by the Christian God simply don't have it as an issue?

- Joel Fagin

because we have a separation of church and state enshrined one of it's official, defining documents and countries like England have a monarch appointed by the Christian God.

TRI · Post by **TRI** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 5:53 pm

Tell that to the antidisestablishmentarianists.

CaptainClaude · Post by **CaptainClaude** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 5:55 pm

ahaugen wrote:
Joel Fagin wrote:Why does the one country that has separation of church and state enshrined in one of it's official, defining documents have trouble with this sort of thing when countries like England who have a monarch appointed by the Christian God simply don't have it as an issue?

- Joel Fagin
because we have a separation of church and state enshrined one of it's official, defining documents and countries like England have a monarch appointed by the Christian God.

yes that would be different if in fact the queen made any real impact on the way we live our lives.

Prime minister we have to listen to. but then he's a christian which is partly why we're involved in bush's god war.

Joel Fagin · Post by **Joel Fagin** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 5:58 pm

ryclaude wrote:yes that would be different if in fact the queen made any real impact on the way we live our lives.

Yeah, but you have the constitutional precedent to be a Christian nation. That's at least a point from where you could start an argument. America doesn't even have that and Christianity is entrenched.

- Joel Fagin

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OMG HE'S A MUSLIM

OMG HE'S A MUSLIM

Yes, I'm actually using it in a sentence.