Please do.

[Rann]

As sick as you are of all this "flag-waving bullshit", there are plenty of people that are just as tired of the anti-America bullshit. If you hate it so much, move to whatever other country you like, and take your comic with you, and neglect to put it back up when you get there. As tired as I was of the eternal procrastination, delays, scetchy comics, and lack of storyline resolution, this pushes it right over the top.
Please take the next plane out of the country, but hope that none of your terrorist buddies are on it.

[Larkain]

Okay stop right there when did George 'Dubah' Bush become the country, yeah it's great that even a man of his intellengce can see when to take steps vs. terrorism but just because BJ says something againist the way Bush has been handling other issues that this country is dealing with does not mean he is making a statement againist America and for terrorism.

[Rann]

Did you even look at that hateful, unpatriotic comic? That's the real bullshit right there.
In this conflict, it's very honestly that if you're not with us, you're against us. BJ has declared himself against us. If he doesn't like the way things are done here, there's nothing other than the fact that he enjoys more freedoms here than anywhere else in the world to keep him here, and frankly, I wish he'd get the hell out and make room for people more worthy of the space he occupied.

Addendum: I wonder if BJ even bothered to check with Caryn whether it was okay to use her in a strip that was a soapbox for his own despicable views?

[Larkain]

Did you even look at that hateful, unpatriotic comic? That's the real bullshit right there.
In this conflict, it's very honestly that if you're not with us, you're against us. BJ has declared himself against us. If he doesn't like the way things are done here, there's nothing other than the fact that he enjoys more freedoms here than anywhere else in the world to keep him here, and frankly, I wish he'd get the hell out and make room for people more worthy of the space he occupied.

And so ushers in a new age of "McCarthy-ism"

The only thing I see represented in the comic is another nation's possible reaction to how Bush has handled the 'War on Terrorism"

[Rann]

And so ushers in a new age of "McCarthy-ism"

No, dumbass. McCarthyism would be saying that spouting that bullshit means Horns is an Al-Queada, and should be forced out of the country. I'm only telling him to follow through on his spiteful little rant of leaving the country of his own will if he dislikes it so much.
If you're going to do your own little witchhunt, at least make sure your historical comparison actually lines up.

[Larkain]

I was not accussing you or anyone by that statement, it was just one of the more recent examples of the fact that seeing things as "Black" or "White"; "Good" or "Evil"; "Us" or "Them" sorta fatalistic view is always a bad idea

The World is Grey

[Rann]

"Black" or "White"; "Good" or "Evil"; "Us" or "Them" sorta fatalistic view is always a bad idea

The World is Grey

No. It's not. A lot of things are in shades of grey. When you go into a country during peacetime, hijack some jets, ram those jets into skyscrapers full of civilians, that is not a shade of grey. That is evil.
That is why anyone bitching about any action the USA has taken in response to that is also not on the right side of things.
This is a very, very big case of good and evil. Horns has spoken out on the side of evil.
Besides, the man's a coward, just like that Baldwin who stated that he'd leave the country if Bush won. He never spoke of it again when it happened, and to my knowledge, hasn't left yet. If Bush does get reelected, Horns will never mention his little declaration again.
And if you've got the balls to follow up on it, Horns, why wait? Why wait for reelection, huh? If you hate what he's doing so much, why go through another two years? Leave now, or are you just sitting there secure in your belief he won't be reelected? Are you that big of a coward, hm?
C'mon, Horns, follow through.

[Larkain]

Horns has spoken out on the side of evil.

I see no where in the comic or rant that he said that the terrorist were right or that action shouldn't have been taken, only that Bush seems to be using this as a chance to ignore issues at home and is perhaps using too much force where persision (sp?) is needed.

[Zorlond]

Okay, Rann, back up from the issue a bit. Take the words and actions spoken in the comic to their most simple meaning. The mosquito wasn't biting Jackie. Next thing she knows, Caryn's slamming her in the face with a mallet.

Simple meanings. Al Queda wasn't harming the people immediately around him. All of a sudden, America comes over and drops bombs. What image do you think they have of us?

Yes, he did an act of pure evil, no argument. But do they even care about what happens to us? Do they even know? Not everyone in the world has cable, you know. Humans are very short-sighted creatures. Unless it's happening in their own neighborhood, odds are high that they don't care.

Our international representatives are some of the sickest-minded b******s I can think of. Not just the military, or the politicians, or even the businessmen. It's also all those Ugly Yankee Tourists that walk into a nice town and shout to the rafters "Thank God I Wasn't Born In Such A Horrible Pigsty!" That's not much of an exaggeration. My one (and only) international tourist vacation, my grandma did that in every stop along the way. Nice way to make friends, no?

[Rann]

It's also all those Ugly Yankee Tourists that walk into a nice town and shout to the rafters "Thank God I Wasn't Born In Such A Horrible Pigsty!" That's not much of an exaggeration. My one (and only) international tourist vacation, my grandma did that in every stop along the way. Nice way to make friends, no?

Your grandmother is not the representative for all Americans, sorry to tell you. Just because your family is a bunch of "Ugly Yankee Tourists", doesn't mean the rest of us are.

[Zorlond]

Your grandmother is not the representative for all Americans, sorry to tell you. Just because your family is a bunch of "Ugly Yankee Tourists", doesn't mean the rest of us are.

So you'd rather believe she was unsual/unique? As you wish.

[Rann]

Your grandmother is not the representative for all Americans, sorry to tell you. Just because your family is a bunch of "Ugly Yankee Tourists", doesn't mean the rest of us are.

So you'd rather believe she was unsual/unique? As you wish.

I've traveled quite a bit, both in this country and out of it. Not once when I was out of the country did I see other Americans shouting such things.
Where were "all" these "Ugly Yankee Tourists" that you say are out there? Were they all perhaps back at your family reunion when I was visiting Europe, Mexico, the Virgin Islands, etc.?

[Dennis K]

::re-reads today's comic just so he's sure he has a solid grasp of it::

Okay, BJ, as far as I can tell, is venting his frustration about how the Bush administration seems to be spending too much time and effort on their "war on terrorism" instead of dealing with problems at home.

Hm. Sounds to me like he just has a problem with the folks in charge of the country, and not the country itself.

You know who else had a problem with the way the country was run? Oh yeah, that would be the first constitutional congress. They didn't care to much for how the British Empire was running things, and so they voiced an opinion and fought for their beliefs.

Then, they created a nifty little thing called the bill of rights. And oh yea, what did that pesky first amendment grant...?

Oh yeah, FREE SPEECH.

You know what this means? This means BJ is entitled to his opinion, just as much as you are entitled to yours, Rann. BJ said he was frustrated with the administration and was venting his frustration and somehow this makes him "against us?"

I don't know about you but I consider BJ a friend, I personally think the 9-11 attack was a tragedy (by the way, I was the guy who did "Comic Aid", and BJ is the only person I know that has linked that site for this long), and I can see where he's coming from with his view. I hardly think he's "Against America."

You say you're not calling him an "Al-Queada, and [that he] should be forced out of the country" but you also say that you "wish he'd get the hell out and make room for people more worthy of the space he occupied."

Different words, same intent. You're saying that BJ, for expressing his beliefs and exercising his right of free speech, isn't "worthy" to be in this country, only because you disagree with his opinion. Now this is just my opinon, Rann, but that sounds awfully fascist to me.

[Rann]

Then, they created a nifty little thing called the bill of rights. And oh yea, what did that pesky first amendment grant...?

Oh yeah, FREE SPEECH.

I never challenged Horns' right to post up the strip. But just because you have the right to do something doesn't mean you should do it.
He hasn't violated any laws. He's violated good taste, though. He's stabbing the mother that shelters him.
Besides, why is it that Horns has the right to say what he wants, but I don't have the right to tell him I think he should take his ass out of the country? Do you judge the right of free speech to be on a first-come-first-serve basis?
Maybe Bush is focusing more on the war on terror than on problems here at home. But what I think that overlooks is that if the focus isn't put on the war on terror, then the "problems at home" will be that women aren't allowed to show their faces or leave the home unescorted.
You seem to not only expect Bush to be God, but to do it while being lambasted by his own countrymen the whole while. Even a nation has to prioritize, and right now I think that stamping out the people that run planes into buildings is a slightly higher priority than making sure our state parks are maintained.

[Towr]

shifting ones attention from what happens at home is the surest way to lose any war..

And the only way to ultimately win a war is to not keep making more and more enemies..

[Rann]

And the only way to ultimately win a war is to not keep making more and more enemies..

This is impossible, exactly because of attitudes like Horns'.
Allow me to quote a guy named Steve Carter, who recently posted the following on alt.fan.furry:

My personal belief is that we need to get the hell out of the Middle East
and let them return to butchering each other like they've been doing for
thousands of years. Problem is that if we do that, we'll be damned for
abandoning the innocents to the despots... who we're damned for wanting to take out of power. Since we're going to be damned anyway, might as well save as much of our own skin as possible and deal with the winner when we're done.

No matter what Bush does, Horns is going to hate him for it, because he hated the man ever since he announced he was a candidate for office. That's how long Horns has been mocking him. If he concentrated on domestic problems, Horns would rail at him for ignoring the tragedy that he himself devoted a strip to, talking about all the emotions he felt that day, anger and sadness among them. But because he focuses on the war, Horns rails at him for not paying attention to domestic problems.
This attitude has spread over the entire world, and in fact is probably one of the leading causes of the tragedy that started this whole mess.

[BJ]

Hi Rann--thought you weren't posting on this forum any more...or reading the strip for that matter. Good to see you back in all your simple minded glory.

Let's see. I love this country. I love being here, the options I have here and the beauty that surrounds me. I hate the way it's run. This isn't a democracy any more, it's pure capitalism. I imagine if I was as blind as you are toward the Propaganda Machine, I'd be happy and I'd be able to see everything so cut and dried. Too bad I've got a more global view.

The people who bombed the Trade Center were wrong, and they don't practise the same beliefs of the folks we bombed trying to get to them. Why do they hate America? Because we're biased in our foreign policy (we'll only help those from whom we have something to gain: natural resources or cheap labour). In their religion, WE are the demon that embodies the ultimate evil and will herald the end of the world (I'm not kidding here). We're bloated, wasteful and power hungry. We try to ram our brand of justice down everyone's throat, whether they're interested in it or not, whether they agree with it or not, and whether or not they deserve it.

Just wait for the next couple strips, Rann. You'll like them, too.

The man who won the presidential election is NOT in the white house. The man who IS there has managed to undo all the progress in domestic policy we've made in the past couple terms.

I'd rant more, but I'm already late for work. By all means, folks, keep talking. I'll explain the strip more when I get back, but it seems that most of you already get it. And for that, thanks.

[Rann]

Just wait for the next couple strips, Rann. You'll like them, too.

If you'll recall, I said that I stopped reading the forums (and I did) before you had a chance to ruin my enjoyment of the comic with your being an asshole. You managed to ruin the comic anyway. It's been deleted from my bookmarks now, so I won't even be reading it by way of habit.
You turned the comic into your own personal soapbox, which is something most self-centered, self-righteous jackasses with a chance to speak to a lot of people do. No doubt you'll continue to enjoy popularity, as by now you've built up a fanbase that will worship what you do not on its own merits, but for the sake of being "fans". Of course, there are those that will still read the strip because they enjoy it.
I won't be one of them. Any enjoyment the strip would have provided has been delayed and put off and mingled with the crap of Tonja Steele, and this most recent strip finally crushed any hope for it ever climbing out of the pit you'd dug it into.

[Zorlond]

Think the rest of us will just pass on talking. Obviously, can't speak on Rann's behalf there, but I think the rest of us are done. He's stated his view, we've stated ours, nothing left that needs to be said. And before you say it, Rann, yes there is plenty more that could be said. But none that needs to be.

[Rann]

And before you say it, Rann, yes there is plenty more that could be said. But none that needs to be.

True enough. I never expected my post to change Horns' mind. (At this point, I feel he has little enough mind to change, since I've lost the shreds of respect I had left for him.) I didn't post it to incite flames or because I expected him to care about my opinion or the loss of my readership. I posted it because it's the way I feel. The comic and his rant offended me, and I don't think it would be right for me to feel offended as I was and to just shrug it off as if it were nothing. I needed to state what I felt, to at least make that small effort to show that I won't just sit around and take whatever everyone dishes out to me without a word.
I have no comic I can use as a soapbox, the best I can do is make my displeasure known with a posting on the message board.