yay my first surgery set!

Schol-R-LEA;2 · Post by **Schol-R-LEA;2** » Sun Nov 27, 2005 1:03 pm

YellowBook wrote:The Sharers in A Door Into Ocean use a chrysalis-like piece of biotechnology for major physical changes (like sex reassignment, though this is a special case as the Sharers are normally an all-female society). Maybe that's what you're remembering?

I haven't read that, so no (I'll have to look into it now, though), but it may have been something similar. I have only heard about the Culture books so far (I'm just starting to read Excession now) so I was going by what I'd heard about it, and I must have confused it with something else, as you said.

Squidflakes · Post by **Squidflakes** » Sun Nov 27, 2005 1:30 pm

Schol-R-LEA;2 wrote:I was thinking of a more high-performance body, Uh-uh...)

That video would have been so much better if she had been naked.

LindaH · Post by **LindaH** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 4:12 am

pig: yeah the MTF results are very good. sadly a lot worse for FTM

Happypeepeehead · Post by **Happypeepeehead** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 5:36 am

well, there's a political theory pioneered by Tristram Taormino that politically, surgeons are unwilling to put the research time needed to make FTM surgeries more often and more successfully since that would suggest giving male power and authority to a woman.

I doubt she considers this as the only reason, but I sincerely doubt this is a reason at all.

Tellner · Post by **Tellner** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 7:05 am

happypeepeehead wrote:well, there's a political theory pioneered by Tristram Taormino that politically, surgeons are unwilling to put the research time needed to make FTM surgeries more often and more successfully since that would suggest giving male power and authority to a woman.

I doubt she considers this as the only reason, but I sincerely doubt this is a reason at all.

Tristan is very knowledgeable in her field. And if I were ever to have someone's hand up my ass it would be hers. That does not give her as much insight into medicine and doctors as she thinks she has. The problem is that reality does not conform to our theories just because we find them beautiful or empowering. It just doesn't wash that most doctors think to themselves "You know. I'm going to go out and do the shittiest job possible just so my patients will have a bad result." Not even the coldest and most mercenary ones. In fact, they'd be the least likely because their whole self image is based on being the miracle worker.

I'm reminded of the early days of AIDS research and activism. ACT UP and all the rest were (and are) politically important. But no matter how much they wanted it to happen vaccines didn't magically appear because of their marches and protests. You still have to take reality as you find int, and the reality is research takes time, money and false starts.

Squidflakes · Post by **Squidflakes** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:16 am

There is a phrase in the medical field "Its easier to dig a hole than to make a mountain"

Toawa · Post by **Toawa** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:18 am

tellner wrote:ACT UP and all the rest were (and are) politically important. But no matter how much they wanted it to happen vaccines didn't magically appear because of their marches and protests.

Unless, of course, their pro-vaccine mojo was directly countered by the anti-vaccine mojo of the people that think that the existance of an AIDS vaccine will usher in a new era of "free love".

Always did enjoy that conspiracy theory.

Honor · Post by **Honor** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 11:41 am

If I was gonna trade up to a more "high performance" body, it'd be something a lot more like this one.

although... we could do something about the puppy face, a little.

Indigo Violent · Post by **Indigo Violent** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 1:43 pm

tellner wrote:But no matter how much they wanted it to happen vaccines didn't magically appear because of their marches and protests.

I'd be readier to believe that if it weren't so obvious that marches and protests can apparently be so effective at preventing medical discoveries. See the recent debacle over the HPV vaccine.
Sigh. People are silly.

Tha_Pig · Post by **Tha_Pig** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 2:39 pm

happypeepeehead wrote:well, there's a political theory pioneered by Tristram Taormino that politically, surgeons are unwilling to put the research time needed to make FTM surgeries more often and more successfully since that would suggest giving male power and authority to a woman.

I doubt she considers this as the only reason, but I sincerely doubt this is a reason at all.

Ah, politics is that magic ingredient that turns everthing it touches into a pooddle of semi-liquid shit.

Personally, I think the reasons are always economic. If there is enough money at play, doctors will forget their "moral principles" and do the reserach. Some great discoveries of science have been forgoten in a drawer just because nobody has seen any immediate potential for PROFIT on them.

Tha_Pig · Post by **Tha_Pig** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 2:44 pm

Honor wrote:If I was gonna trade up to a more "high performance" body, it'd be something a lot more like this one.

although... we could do something about the puppy face, a little.

Oh, my eyes!!! Nothing turns me off like seen a woman who has more muscles than I have.

But then again... that may include 90 percent of the female population!

Happypeepeehead · Post by **Happypeepeehead** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 3:27 pm

Honor wrote:If I was gonna trade up to a more "high performance" body, it'd be something a lot more like this one.

although... we could do something about the puppy face, a little.

As a wrestling enthusiast, gotta warn you that Joanie Lauer (aka Chyna) is as nimble as van with popped tires, HAS had surgery on that face multiple times (as well as a chest job), which she, judging by photos of her when she was a younger weightlifter, didn't need until she started consuming performance enhancers. I'll dig up the photos of when she was younger if you're interested. The muscles are considerably smaller, but she wasn't distorted as she is now and still had all the parts she was born with.

Jackalope · Post by **Jackalope** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 5:45 pm

Gah. That shot on the left looks like a not-very-successful drag queen. The arms, back and shoulders just look all wrong. And the shot on the right doesn't help much, with the cannonball boob job. Muscular is okay, but I have to agree with the verdict of "distorted."

Heh. Reminds me of the friend who took a Barbie doll and stuck GI Joe's arms and legs on it and gave it a buzzcut. "Barbara, Death Dyke."

Happypeepeehead · Post by **Happypeepeehead** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 5:50 pm

Barring seeing a karyotype to confirm it, to my knowledge she is a natural woman.

Jackalope · Post by **Jackalope** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 6:38 pm

I believe it, I just count her as an example of what "performance enhancers" can do to someone.

Swordsman3003 · Post by **Swordsman3003** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 6:49 pm

Schol-R-LEA;2 wrote:Good fortune in your surgery.

get that model

Uh-uh...)

I have never seen anything more arousing in my entire life.

Tellner · Post by **Tellner** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:07 pm

Hey, guys, don't be too rough on Chyna. After all, steroids can have unfortunate side effects on women. Like excessive hair growth. On their balls.

Honor · Post by **Honor** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 10:07 pm

tellner wrote:Like excessive hair growth. On their balls.

Of all the comments so far, this is the one that left me just falling about the place laughing. "Barbara, Death Dyke" was a very near second, though

While I fully agree that the sad side effects of steroids and such don't balance out the costs, that's where the agreement ends. The "not very successful drag queen" picture is mad sexy to me, and as long as I can keep my eyes from her neck down, the other one is just fine as well.

Yeah, the boob job is dead obvious. So is eyeliner and lipstick, but I like that on some girls, too.

It's only when the testosterone markers in her face (heavy brow & jaw, etc) intrude on my vision that any picture of Chyna bothers me in the least. Oh, and... In the second picture, the hint at a 30's style hairdo is a tragic error, as well, of course.

Of course, Joanie doesn't fit into that category, but if I could find an intelligent lesbian body builder... Oh, my. I'd have her, or go to jail for stalking from trying. And once I managed to seduce her, it'd be awfully difficult to get me out of bed for a few weeks.

Tellner · Post by **Tellner** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 11:17 pm

I actually used that line in real life once. A coworker had taken up bodybuilding for fun and self confidence. She got sucked into the orbit of a guy who got her into competitions and wanted to make money off her. "I made you. I know what's best for you. Do what I say."

He was pressuring her to take anabolic steroids and HGH.

I finally talked her out of it. The line that got her attention was that these things caused (list of symptoms) and excessive hair growth. She said "I know about that." I replied "On your nuts." She turned kind of pale and started to rethink.

LindaH · Post by **LindaH** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 5:15 am

update on my surgery. got to hospital at 8. the guy that was to get surgery before me was too sick to get it so i was rushed in.. so wope up again at 11. sent home at 13.

surgery went really well. it is really swollen and sore right now though but i can see a difference. he really took a huge chunk out of my adams apple

no complications really cept my heart started racing one time when i was in the waky up room but then calmed down again (was probably dreaming of my hunny ,) )

so now i am home. sore, a tad nauseous and will go to bed...

night all