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And the Dems say the Republicans should talk with Iran about stopping them from making nukes. We tried that with Kroea. And guess what.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,218699,00.html

I hope this doesn't lead to Japan Glowing.

Shit, man! That's like... just now.

Hopefully their stellar missile program will keep on track, and they'll end up glowing themselves, instead.

Responses as of 1:40 EST:

South Korean govt's having an emergency meeting and placed its military on high alert.

Japan's having an emergency meeting to put together a special task force. Analysis is this will push through the incoming Prime Minister's existing proposal to remove Article 9 of the post-war constitution, allowing Japan to rearm and officially have a military again

Australia's issued a statement that it will "advocate a UN Security Council regime against [North Korea] which includes targeted financial and travel sanctions, other trade restrictions and/or aviation restrictions". "

China appears to be starting to cut its losses on NK (and _really_ doesn't like the idea of a re-militarized Japan) as it reportedly passed onto the US, Japan, and SK the 20 minute warning NK provided China with prior to this test.

US is expected to file a resolution at the UN similar to the Australian proposal.

Adding to the fun: The next Secretary General of the UN (barring last minute changes in threatened vetos against the other candidates from members of the Security Council) is South Korea's foreign minister

The solution to this is easy, offer every North Korean a cheeseburger if they rise up and overthrow the greasy haired little tyrant. Heck, even a happy meal has more food than most of the people there eat in a week.

My daughter is in Japan and she says they are PO'd over there.

I agree, if China doesn't want a rearmed AND nuclear Japan they had better step on North Korea and fast.

Kimmy boy wants Nukes so bad? I say we deliver some the easy way...

Can't nuke em'. That would just add fuel to some fires that don't need it.

They'd have to attack with a nuke to recive a nuke.

Nice thing is we don't need to let it hit North Korea to knock them out. If it blows up far enough above, Hello EMP.

Still, nuking is over kill and bad for relations.

We can't nuke the norks. Period. They're too small. China, Japan, and/or RoK would get fallout. We should have been preparing for this for the past half decade at least, but we're being lead by shortsighted fools. We need a non-radioactive city killer, either something like fuel air explosives mounted on a MIRV with improved terminal guidance or a space based kinetic kill system. We don't have it and aren't even trying to get it even though we know nukes aren't a credible first strike threat against nations that are either in close proximity to allies or important neutrals or that have valuable natural resources we don't want irradiated.

Sciguy wrote:Nice thing is we don't need to let it hit North Korea to knock them out. If it blows up far enough above, Hello EMP.

Also EMP's China, South Korea, and probably Japan and part of Siberia. All of which are probably more technologically developed than NK.

Atarlost wrote:... We should have been preparing for this for the past half decade at least ... We don't have it and aren't even trying to get it ...

Are you sure we don't have them? Yes, they haven't been deployed (unless a claim I recently heard of a neutron bomb over an Iraqi airport was realy a city-killer like you describe), but how hard would it be to conceal an alternate semi-conventional warhead in the nuclear missile program?

I don't see NK lobbing A-bombs indiscriminately; that's a quick way to get hammered back. But if used as a threat and his bluff is called, I can see Kim being "forced" to use one "to keep from looking weak". Then everybody else gets p*ssed off and removes him and NK from the planet.

Atarlost wrote: We need a non-radioactive city killer, either something like fuel air explosives

How about a couple of MOABs?

Atarlost wrote: or a space based kinetic kill system. We don't have it and aren't even trying to get it

....actually, R&D's had the space-based system listed for a couple years now as the 'Lightning Rod' and 'Rod of God', basically a nice solid rod of metal designed to be lobbed at high speed from orbit. Or what we Shadowrun fans would refer to as 'Thor Shot'.

Now, how far R&D's actually gotten with said device.... I'll just note military tech's often a decade or more beyond civilian tech. Anything the military's likely to show publically as far as advanced toys already is likely to be a few generations behind whatever designs are sitting on the shelf waiting for the go-ahead.

Earl McClaw wrote:

Sciguy wrote:Nice thing is we don't need to let it hit North Korea to knock them out. If it blows up far enough above, Hello EMP.

Also EMP's China, South Korea, and probably Japan and part of Siberia. All of which are probably more technologically developed than NK.

Was some suggestions we were going to field test an EMP bomb on Iraq during the invasion. Was eventually deemed unnecessary tho. EMP wouldn't necessarily be a good idea against NK tho on the simple reason that they don't have that much to actually knock out with the blast.

Earl McClaw wrote: I don't see NK lobbing A-bombs indiscriminately; that's a quick way to get hammered back. But if used as a threat and his bluff is called, I can see Kim being "forced" to use one "to keep from looking weak". Then everybody else gets p*ssed off and removes him and NK from the planet.

May've changed, but last I heard (a year or two ago) analysis was Tokyo's most likely to be the target if Kim Jung-Mentally-Il decides to go the nuclear suicide route. Based on historical reasons as much as limits in available delivery systems.

This would be part of my earlier note in this thread that NK's test is likely to strengthen the hand of the incoming Japanese PM in attempting to remilitarize. Which is something China _really_ doesn't want to see happen. ...also add in that there's been a few reports that Japan's government is now considering whether a pre-emptive strike on NK would qualify as "self-defense" under the current constitution.

It's scary stuff and a last resort.

Never use what you got unless pushed.

[quote="Sciguy"]I hope this doesn't lead to Japan Glowing.[/quote]

No kidding -- I've already paid for my Nippon 2007 trip. [semi- :) ]

As for Solving This Problem: The blueprints for the WW2 "Grand Slam"
bomb (look it up) still exist. Take that design, add GPS guidance and
maneuver-capable fins, load with whatever's the most powerful milspec
explosive these days, crank out as many as possible as fast as possible,
and proceed to "Cast Summon Chtonian" on selected locations.

Then watch what remains of their Sanity go away....

gosh, such great fun, and in two months I'm going to be living in Thailand. for antoher 22 months. Let's hope a giant firefight doesn'thappen right over my head T.T I already have enough concerns. I wish I could contribute more to the discussion, but I'm afriad I've never been to good as discussing political topics.

ChronicMisadventures wrote:....actually, R&D's had the space-based system listed for a couple years now as the 'Lightning Rod' and 'Rod of God', basically a nice solid rod of metal designed to be lobbed at high speed from orbit. Or what we Shadowrun fans would refer to as 'Thor Shot'.

Now, how far R&D's actually gotten with said device.... I'll just note military tech's often a decade or more beyond civilian tech. Anything the military's likely to show publically as far as advanced toys already is likely to be a few generations behind whatever designs are sitting on the shelf waiting for the go-ahead.

Most engineers I've spoken with in the last year tell me that the "Rods from God" is not as useful as most people have been led to think.

Fun little addition to this topic: As of this morning, South Korean news sources were reporting that North Korea is now threatening to launch "a nuclear-tipped missile" at America unless their demands are met. (that was off the news radio station I was listening to. Other US news sources've just said 'a missile').

Said initial demand being a personal meeting between NK and the US (Kim's previously demanded personal meetings with Bush rather than the six-party talks)....at which NK will likely demand we let them resume counterfitting US currency and provide them with free oil and other supplies, as per the Clinton agreement they cheated on.

...course given their past missile attempts, they'd probably accidentally hit China instead.

Ok, here's my new idea.. Let's have the US sell the South Korean government some Nukes at bargain price. We'll see how much of a nuclear trigger finger Kim has when he's got the business end of a fully-functional nuke staring him in the face...

LoneWolf23k wrote:Ok, here's my new idea.. Let's have the US sell the South Korean government some Nukes at bargain price. We'll see how much of a nuclear trigger finger Kim has when he's got the business end of a fully-functional nuke staring him in the face...

Actually, there's been suggestions we give Japan a couple (not that they couldn't have their own in a relatively short time if they wanted to). It'd serve the double purpose of worrying both NK and China. And even the threat of Japan considering going nuclear due to NK might push China into stomping on Kim.

If the Japanese build a nuke it'll double as a game console, cell phone, karaoke machine and will activate every garage door opener in the northern hemisphere.

And it can only be launched by a petulant, panicky teenager with frightwig hair and enormous eyes....

RHJunior wrote:If the Japanese build a nuke it'll double as a game console, cell phone, karaoke machine and will activate every garage door opener in the northern hemisphere.

And it can only be launched by a petulant, panicky teenager with frightwig hair and enormous eyes....

You forgot to note that it'll have the ability to transform into a giant robot as well.